BajaNomad

Pescadero - 2 norteamericanos die in hotel

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AKgringo - 8-12-2023 at 11:40 AM

About twelve years ago I did an inspection of the natural gas fired forced air furnace in my dad's home. I found a crack in the heat exchanger that would allow CO to blend with the forced air, so we replaced it with a new unit.

The old, loud, and inefficient unit had a double wall galvanized flue that got pretty hot! The heat exchanger on the new unit is so efficient that the exhaust gas is cooler than you would get from a typical hair dryer. The plastic flue runs horizontal and has never been much more than room temperature.

I suppose the new heat exchanger could crack and change things, but so far it has not been a problem.

surabi - 8-12-2023 at 12:06 PM

"The workman thought it was all BS...they were astounded at the fact that these P-nche gringos wanted something of proven effectiveness and quality."

That is a problem in Mexico, even when it doesn't concern something dangerous. There seems to be an ingrained attitude of saving money by cutting corners, or "making do", which I can understand when people don't have any extra money to spend, and which is a big factor in Mexican ingenuity, which is admirable in many cases.

But they haven't adjusted that attitude when working for gringoes, who would usually rather spend more money to do things right the first time, instead of saving money now, only to have to redo it later.

I've seen this when I had my house built here with things like using cheap primer on metalwork, so things rust quicky and have to be repainted in a short period of time. There's nothing wrong with trying to save money, but the workers should at least present a choice to the consumer- " I can use this primer, which costs XX, or this one, which costs twice as much, but will result in a more long-lasting job."

An elderly friend had some workers she'd had for years, who were also friends who really cared about her and tried to look after her. She needed her house repainted and had bought expensive Sherman Williams paint, as she wanted it to last a long time. She caught them watering down the paint, and when she said No! and why were they doing that, that it defeated the purpose of buying high quality paint, they said they were just trying to save her money.


[Edited on 8-12-2023 by surabi]

Tioloco - 8-12-2023 at 12:22 PM

Quote: Originally posted by surabi  
"The workman thought it was all BS...they were astounded at the fact that these P-nche gringos wanted something of proven effectiveness and quality."

That is a problem in Mexico, even when it doesn't concern something dangerous. There seems to be an ingrained attitude of saving money by cutting corners, or "making do", which I can understand when people don't have any extra money to spend, and which is a big factor in Mexican ingenuity, which is admirable in many cases.

But they haven't adjusted that attitude when working for gringoes, who would usually rather spend more money to do things right the first time, instead of saving money now, only to have to redo it later.

I've seen this when I had my house built here with things like using cheap primer on metalwork, so things rust quicky and have to be repainted in a short period of time. There's nothing wrong with trying to save money, but the workers should at least present a choice to the consumer- " I can use this primer, which costs XX, or this one, which costs twice as much, but will result in a more long-lasting job."

An elderly friend had some workers she'd had for years, who were also friends who really cared about her and tried to look after her. She needed her house repainted and had bought expensive Sherman Williams paint, as she wanted it to last a long time. She caught them watering down the paint, and when she said No! and why were they doing that, that it defeated the purpose of buying high quality paint, they said they were just trying to save her money.


[Edited on 8-12-2023 by surabi]


Surabi-

I noticed that you used the word “caught” to describe when your friend found these helpers trying to save her money.

What does that sound like to you?? Just curious.. ;)

surabi - 8-13-2023 at 10:44 AM

??? It doesn't "sound like" anything but what it says. That she saw them adding water to the paint.

Don Pisto - 8-13-2023 at 11:10 AM

Quote: Originally posted by monoloco  
Quote: Originally posted by Paco Facullo  
As a retired Plumbing contractor and avid traveler, I have inspected the plumbing in meny Countries. My conclusion is that it is installed to just "work" without any regard so safety.

When I visited Cuba, my reason for being there was professional research, so I started a website and interviewed workers on construction sites. I also examined and took photos of as much plumbing as I could. Needless to say, it just has to work..

Mexico is pretty much the same...
The problem in Mexico is that there is no licensing or standards for becoming an electrician or a plumber, and here in Baja Sur, there's a double whammy of no inspections. There is so much work here that typically what happens is that a kid will go to work for a plumber/electrician for a few months or a year, then he'll decide that he knows enough to become a plumbing contractor and hire his primo or sobrino, and start bidding jobs, then in a few months the sobrino will also become a contractor, rinse and repeat. It doesn't take long for this to lead to a whole bunch of plumbers/electricians who never learned the basic concepts of their trade, who leave a trail of shoddy and dangerous work in their wake.



god bless em they try! :lol:

mtgoat666 - 11-29-2023 at 06:44 PM

About 6 months have passed since the rancho pescadero hotel guests died…
Did they ever find the cause?
Did the hotel reopen yet?

Lee - 11-29-2023 at 07:18 PM

https://www.latimes.com/socal/daily-pilot/news/newsletter/20...

pacificobob - 11-30-2023 at 08:30 AM

Hotel not open yet. However, an attached restaurant has opened. World class cuisine by an Italian chef. This top shelf chow is not in any way inexpensive but worth every centavo.

towntaco - 12-27-2023 at 07:28 AM

Quote: Originally posted by pauldavidmena  
Here's an update from the Todos Santos Newsfeed on Facebook:

"Many of you may have read the tragic news about the two Americans, Abby Lutz and John Heathco that lost their precious lives in a hotel room in Pescadero, BCS Mexico. What you may have not heard about are the two first responders that almost lost their lives as well, Fernando Valencia Sotelo and Grisel Valencia Sotelo. The brother and sister team were the attending to Abby and John when they quickly became overcome. They were able to exit the room just in time before Grisel collapsed to the ground. Fernando was able to get himself and Grisel back to their ambulance and administer oxygen to himself and to her. They were then rushed to the hospital by other team members. The hospital in La Paz did what they could but they do not have the proper treatment facilities. Today, since Grisel and Fernando were still feeling very ill and were very concerned about long-term effects, as a team we decided to take them to a private hospital in San Jose del Cabo."

OSHA training talks about gas leaks most often killing two additional people beyond the first people to be taken down as responders, whether rescue or not, rush in and then are overcome themselves. It's gnarly, sad and quite often avoidable.

Lee - 12-27-2023 at 08:50 AM

Bought this meter when the story broke. I travel with it now.



https://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/B09YRGH72R/?_encoding=UTF8&am...

mtgoat666 - 12-27-2023 at 09:02 AM

I stayed in a Hyatt last month, and did not die. I was one of the lucky ones!

RFClark - 12-27-2023 at 02:06 PM

The local news indicates that they are in the process of or just have reopened that Hyatt. Locals have been complaining about generators running at night,

towntaco - 12-27-2023 at 02:50 PM

Quote: Originally posted by Lee  
Bought this meter when the story broke. I travel with it now.



https://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/B09YRGH72R/?_encoding=UTF8&am...

I recommend similar to friends who have done diesel heater setups on their campers. Probably not a terrible idea to just have while traveling.

mtgoat666 - 12-27-2023 at 05:14 PM

Quote: Originally posted by RFClark  
The local news indicates that they are in the process of or just have reopened that Hyatt. Locals have been complaining about generators running at night,


Must be hard to sleep at that hyatt, eh? With the toxic fume history, i would be keeping the windows open while i sleep, but generators running all night and an open window are a recipe for insomnia…

mtgoat666 - 6-12-2024 at 11:19 PM

Hyatt’s Rancho Pescadero rebranded as IHG Kimpton’s Mas Olas.

Same owner, reportedly. Dont know if they got rid of the managers or staff who disabled the gas detectors/alarms.

Also unkown if hotel is haunted…






[Edited on 6-13-2024 by mtgoat666]

pacificobob - 6-13-2024 at 06:53 AM

Quote: Originally posted by surabi  
??? It doesn't "sound like" anything but what it says. That she saw them adding water to the paint.


About 20 years ago i was having a plumber do some work. I forgot exactly what he was doing, but it involved a great deal of silicone and other shoddy plumbing practices. I made a comment to him about it. His reply was along the line of ...hey this is not a wealthy country, we have to make do.
Delivered with a rather salty attitude. I remember that conversation to this day when supervising workers.

surabi - 6-13-2024 at 03:38 PM

I do admire the inventiveness of Mexicans in making do with a modicum of tools and materials. But I really hate it when they smear big lumps of silicone all over instead of using proper fittings. :lol:


[Edited on 6-13-2024 by surabi]

pacificobob - 6-14-2024 at 02:17 PM

When a plumber shows up with only a pair of slip groove pliers (channel locks) and a huge tube of silicone, it's a bad sign.
I can't remember the last time a tradesman has done work for me without needing some of my tools.

surabi - 6-14-2024 at 02:57 PM

And watch out if you let them use your tools! They'll use your best wood chisel to pry open a can of paint. :yes:

I'm not sure I'd consider someone a "tradesman" who didn't come equipped with the normal tools of his trade.

Like "gardeners" who are basically just hose holders and don't even have a pair of their own clippers.

I and some of my neighbors used to have a guy work for us who was a sort of jack-of-all trades, although I wouldn't have used him as a plumber or electrician and he didn't claim to be one.

But he did gardening, cement and tile work, outside clean-up, or just physical labor, like moving stones, or whatever in the wheelbarrow.

Depending on what he was coming to do, he always brought his own tools, whether it was garden clippers and a machete, or a cement hod and a trowel.

He was also self-sufficient in that he always brought his lunch and a big thermos of water. He never left to go to the store to get a bottle of coke and some chips or take-out like a lot of workers do, never asked for water or expected to be fed lunch. And he was so sweet- he often brought something for me in his lunch, like he'd bring 2 granola bars and say "This one's for you."

Also, he was gay, which as a single woman meant I never had to deal with the "Where's your husband?", "Do you have a boyfriend?", and other of those sorts of MYOB stuff I get from Mexican men.

I was sorry to lose him when he moved from the area.

[Edited on 6-14-2024 by surabi]

cupcake - 6-14-2024 at 05:10 PM

Quote: Originally posted by Cliffy  


...(Remember we're talking CO (carbon monoxide, and NOT CO2, carbon Dioxide a product of exhalation)...


CO2 can also be deadly. There have been a number of deaths in camping/climbing tents, where the door zipper was closed all the way. CO2 buildup caused 'deep sleep' and subsequent suffocation.

CO2 can also be quite dangerous in automobiles, causing drowsiness which has lead to serious crashes. In autos, this becomes more of a concern when there are many passengers. This has been confirmed via blood tests of crash victims, which revealed high CO2 level.

[Edited on 6-15-2024 by cupcake]

mtgoat666 - 6-14-2024 at 05:19 PM

And this shocking story of a resort killing a customer:

An El Paso man died after being electrocuted in a jacuzzi at a resort hotel in the Mexican beach town of Puerto Peñasco, popularly also known as Rocky Point. The wife survived, but is in critical condition.
https://www.elpasotimes.com/story/news/2024/06/12/hot-tub-el...

Faulty maintenance or faulty construction? Hired untrained or unqualified staff?



[Edited on 6-15-2024 by mtgoat666]

cupcake - 6-14-2024 at 05:36 PM

I don't have an opinion as to cause/fault in that particular case.

In years past, I spent a lot of time in South East Asia, and especially Thailand. The monsoons would sometimes cause failures in the earth grounds of buildings. I remember two electrocution deaths there one year. A female tourist was electrocuted in the hotel room shower, where the shower head was on an extended flexible metallic hose, which unfortunately had acquired a dangerous voltage. Her male companion tried to remove her from the shower and was also killed.

Sometime after this event, I discovered the same type of metallic hose in a shower at my parents house. I replaced it with a plastic hose.

As a safety suggestion, I recommend touching metal shower knobs, etc., with the back of your hand first, as a test. If there is voltage at the knob, your hand will usually recoil from it. Whereas, if you grab the metal knob as most people do, you might not be able to let go.

Another observation: touching two points with your two hands at the same time, such as sink or shower knobs, when a voltage is present, can create an electrical path through your chest and heart. Whereas, using only one hand might create an electrical path from hand to foot, skirting the chest and missing the heart.

[Edited on 6-15-2024 by cupcake]

surabi - 6-14-2024 at 06:19 PM

You might be surprised how many places in Mexico aren't grounded at all. All the plug outlets in the storefront I rented years ago were 2-prong.
Why pay for 3 wires when you can get away with two? :lol:

[Edited on 6-15-2024 by surabi]

[Edited on 6-15-2024 by surabi]

lencho - 6-14-2024 at 08:59 PM

Quote: Originally posted by surabi  
You might be surprised how many places in Mexico aren't grounded at all. All the plug outlets in the storefront I rented years ago were 2-prong.

And most of the time that's not a problem (endpoint grounds weren't even required or common in the U.S. till after you and I were born).

A wiring detail I've occasionally run into which is more dangerous, are 2-prong receptacles with the hot and neutral reversed. There's a reason many two-prong plugs are polarized (one prong wider than the other).

I routinely check polarity on outlets when I rent a place; everyone should have a basic voltmeter as part of their kit (they're cheap).

cupcake - 6-15-2024 at 10:33 AM

In a properly installed and operating electrical system, a Ground Fault Circuit Interrupter can be a lifesaver. The problem is that GFCIs are too often absent or not working properly.

The Differences Between GFCI Circuit Breakers and GFCI Receptacle Outlets
https://www.baypower.com/blog/the-differences-between-gfci-c...

Chasing "ghost" trips in GFCI-protected circuits
https://www.fluke.com/en-us/learn/blog/grounding/chasing-gho...

[Edited on 6-15-2024 by cupcake]

cupcake - 6-15-2024 at 12:59 PM

Quote: Originally posted by mtgoat666  
And this shocking story of a resort killing a customer:

An El Paso man died after being electrocuted in a jacuzzi at a resort hotel in the Mexican beach town of Puerto Peñasco, popularly also known as Rocky Point. The wife survived, but is in critical condition.
https://www.elpasotimes.com/story/news/2024/06/12/hot-tub-el...

Faulty maintenance or faulty construction? Hired untrained or unqualified staff?


Experts assess jacuzzi tragedy in Puerto Peñasco resort involving an El Paso couple
https://www.ktsm.com/news/experts-asses-jacuzzi-tragedy-in-p...

The expert in the above linked article discusses the likelihood of a non-existent or faulty GFCI. This would also be my suspicion, but without enough information it is not possible to know with certainty.

[Edited on 6-15-2024 by cupcake]

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